Cropmaster Fuel Issue

The place to discuss all matters relating to David Brown Tractors. You will need to register your user name before you can post. If you have already registered could you please make sure that your location details have been completed. Go to My Account in the Main Menu on the left, and then go into "Edit Your Information" and complete your location details. Give the Country (and State/Province if you wish) if outside the U.K. County if within the U.K. Location details helps other members if you need spares, technical advice, or the nearest practical help.

Please note the Forum Site is not managed by David Brown Tractor Club Ltd only hosted

DISCLAIMER -

David Brown Tractor
Forum/website Disclaimer

1. This [forum/website/chat room] and the advice and opinions expressed herein is not a solution for mechanical, electrical, valuations, other problems, breakdowns or issues experienced in relation to the vehicles referenced.

2. If reliance is thought to be placed on any of the information guidance or input provided such information will be expressly confirmed as appropriate to be relied upon.

3. In the absence of any such confirmation no reliance should be suggested or inferred.

4. Members must not disclose information to 3rd parties in anticipation that reliance will be given by non-members.

5. Non-members must not purport to give advice on behalf of David Brown Tractor Club.

6. If you or someone you know is experiencing difficulties or repeated breakdowns you must seek assistance for an appropriately qualified expert who holds themselves out as such.

7. Any comments are free of charge and made or posted on an ex gratia basis. No member or non-member may advertise their professional services


Please be aware that your user name and entered location can be seen by all members. We only store information you have entered which is your email address and username, your IP is also stored, we have no access to private passwords.

If you do not agree with your information being stored, please do not register an account, If you wish to unsubscribe at any time please email callysmith95@outlook,com giving your username.

Amended 27/10/18

Moderator: admin

Post Reply
User avatar
tractorfan
Posts: 94
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2014 8:25 am
Location: Ceredigion

Cropmaster Fuel Issue

Post by tractorfan » Sat May 18, 2019 12:14 pm

I have a 1948 Cropmaster petrol/tvo. Last summer I changed the cork seal in the changeover tap due to a leak. Since then, whenever the tractor starts to pull uphill the engine stops. The tractor will then start again quite easily on the handle and will progress again up the hill for a few yards until the engine stops again. Once I get to some flat land the tractor will run fine. So something has obviously gone wrong when I changed the cork seal (at least that's what it looks like at the moment). Any ideas what it could be before I drain the tanks and inspect the tap and seal?

Many thanks.

User avatar
GeoffDEAL
Posts: 559
Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2009 8:25 am
Location: New Zealand

Re: Cropmaster Fuel Issue

Post by GeoffDEAL » Sat May 18, 2019 10:31 pm

Hi does it make any difference if the tap is on reserve or main supply? or maybe some dirt got dislodged when you removed the tap and got to the carb maybe check and give it a clean, First remove outlet pipes and move tap to see if fuel is running on positions.

User avatar
cobbadog
Posts: 1081
Joined: Tue Oct 11, 2011 6:18 am
Location: beautiful Coopernook NSW. near Taree. NSW. Australia

Re: Cropmaster Fuel Issue

Post by cobbadog » Sun May 19, 2019 7:25 am

Other thing to consider is the air hole in the fuel caps. I had a blockage that I was unaware of in the air hole and it would run for around an hour then stop. Re-start and it would go for a short distance then stop, finally figured mine out.
As suggested check the fuel flow from the tap outlet going to the carby. This is the simplest way of finding out if the blockage is in the tap or at the pick up points in your tank. My tanks had a lot of rust and dirt inside them and as you can not clean much out by turning the tank upside down because of the filler tubes inside the tank the only way to clean the inside out is to flush and re-flush over and over. I did that a few times while the tank was off the tractor but using an endoscope I looked inside and it was still filthy in there. So off to the hardware store and I bought a litre of hydrochloric acid and put about 3/4 of it inside the tank. I had used blanks to block off the tank outlet so it would hold the acid. I sat the tank on a level bench for an hour then turned it onto it's side for an hour and kept turning the tank over until all sides and ends were treated. The colour of the acid that came out was disgusting. Then I kept flushing it with water until I was satisfied that all was diluted inside. Used the endoscope again and it was like brand new inside and no traces of dirt rust or dust. I then left the tank out in the full sun with the filler caps off so the heat would evaporate what water was left behind. I was satisfied that it was all gone but I still put an egg cup full of metholated spirits (white spirits) inside to soak up and traces of moisture.

baron_beeza
Posts: 27
Joined: Sat Jun 29, 2019 1:25 pm
Location: NZ

Re: Cropmaster Fuel Issue

Post by baron_beeza » Fri Jul 17, 2020 9:53 am

My Cropmaster was running with some issues. It is a TVO/Petrol model that I have been running on the rear tank. Well that was the plan but I was losing fuel to the main tank. It is going to need the tank out and some serious repair work done.
I only have a small farmlet so don't use much fuel and the plan was to find a suitable small tank.

Somewhere along the line things changed a little. I had an old 25C tank that was given to me.
The photos may tell the story.
I plan to fit this tank back to front to have the 'filler' about where the scuttle would be.

Image

Image

Image


Image

Once the Cropmaster tank is repaired and refitted I will probably repeat the routine with the 25C.
Then again I may enjoy running about with clean fresh fuel.

User avatar
db2d
Posts: 2389
Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2012 10:01 pm
Location: Monmouthshire

Re: Cropmaster Fuel Issue

Post by db2d » Fri Jul 17, 2020 10:24 am

The substitute tank is off a single fuel tractor, either petrol or diesel not TVO. If you are only going to use petrol the existing tank will be ok providing it is not leaking externally. The duel fuel tank has a small tank in the rear. There are sealants that can be used but they are not very successful.

After further scrutiny the Tank is not from a 25C. It is from a 25/30D

User avatar
cobbadog
Posts: 1081
Joined: Tue Oct 11, 2011 6:18 am
Location: beautiful Coopernook NSW. near Taree. NSW. Australia

Re: Cropmaster Fuel Issue

Post by cobbadog » Fri Jul 17, 2020 12:16 pm

You have gone this far with that tank. finish cutting the base off and that will give you great access to properly clean the inside of the tank, then weld a new base on complete with the locating lugs in the correct position. You will need to change the fuel tap to a single tap not the dual one and away you can go. If there were only small holes a fuel tank repair kit would have done the job but looking at those holes you are going the right way. The repair kit I used worked very well for cleaning and treating the rust and finally sealing or coating the inside of the tank.
You can also keep an eye out for a good second hand tank, they do exist. With the original tap and the new cork gasket it is best to remove the tap from the frame, strip it down again and thoroughly clen out the galleries. The real tricky one to get clean and can hold rust is the gallery that runs inside the tap handle that aligns the holes up in the body. Easy to clean but you do need to get in there with good light and a twist drill bit by hand. It may have been 3/16" diameter to clean the holes but only by hand.

baron_beeza
Posts: 27
Joined: Sat Jun 29, 2019 1:25 pm
Location: NZ

Re: Cropmaster Fuel Issue

Post by baron_beeza » Fri Jul 17, 2020 7:47 pm

Yes, this was only a junk tank that happened to come with the 25C that I got. I remembered the story that the previous owner had told me about how they had replaced the tank many years earlier and the tractor had been sitting for about 8 to 10 years. My problem was that I ended up with two tractors that both had seized engines etc. I actually made a point of ringing to save him throwing this old junk tank out. He though he already had.
With the Cropmaster I removed the rocker shaft and freed them, then after removing the distributor attempted to turn the engine over. That was easy as I have a compressed air fitting on my aircraft leakdown tester that applies regulated pressure to the spark-plug 18mm hole.
I did both engines using the same gear. With 100psi on each cylinder,in turn, I could not only blow Inox down past the rings but also get assistance in breaking the engine free. The air also gave a good indication of valve condition.
Same with the electrics, rather than use the original Lucas stuff I made up a modified Japanese car distributor.
Anyway, I had both tractors running but really only sufficient good reliable running gear for 1.8 tractors.
I bought a cheap Solex side-draft carb that will be donating parts and I am still toying with fitting the aircraft magneto.

The 25C is awaiting rear tyres, I am thinking of using the 11 inch rims and wider tyres as an option there. Although the Cropmaster was being used I had a dirty fuel issue, along with the tank problem. I would put 5 litres into the petrol tank but it soon leaked into the main tank and I would subsequently run out. I had only been using the tractor for 20 to 30 minutes a day.
Running the 25C was giving me a similar headache, basically both tanks have an internal rust issue that needs addressing.
By putting the 5 litre plastic insert into this junk tank I can now have a reliable fuel supply and use the tractor while I address the other two 'good' tanks.
I think I will cut the bottom out of the 25C, whatever is currently with that tractor anyway, and then finish the original twin tank Cropmaster one. I am sure both original tanks will be a mess inside. I expect to be welding new bottoms on.
I am not restoring a tractor however, I want a reliable tractor to use in the meantime. I have come upon a transport tray (free) and a grader blade ($25) that I am keen to put to use. The transmission not only got a good clean out but NEW oil so the hydraulics are good to go.


I have learned from Cobbadog's experiences and rather than continue running both engines with crappy old tanks any running from now on will be with plastic tanks only. I will be by-passing the two-way tap also. At least until both original tanks are repaired and restored back to 'as-new'.

This junk tank may even get a new bottom but only after it has completed it's job. Well worth saving from the scrap heap and it cost absolutely nothing to make-up. About an hour to cut some holes and fit the tyre valve.

Working
Image

As I was given the thing, complete with issues.
Image

tomryall
Posts: 193
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2007 4:53 am
Location: canada

Re: Cropmaster Fuel Issue

Post by tomryall » Sat Jul 18, 2020 3:05 am

I have a 49 Cropmaster very simliar to the one in the picture, what interests me is the headlights I was given a pair with the tractor when I bought it , the previous owner said he thought they belonged to the tractor but he wasn't sure ,they are CAV just like the ones in the picture, so it looks like they are an original DB fitting ,

baron_beeza
Posts: 27
Joined: Sat Jun 29, 2019 1:25 pm
Location: NZ

Re: Cropmaster Fuel Issue

Post by baron_beeza » Sat Jul 18, 2020 5:30 am

I am not sure about the headlights. I knew they were different but they are mounted without the customary brackets. I will have a look and take a close up pic for you.

Image

I haven't mounted my gash tank yet but did have it running great with just the 5 litre bottle sitting up behind the engine.

Before I was just too impatient and had it running but with just a basic fuel system. I was missing the banjo bolt at the carb so just had an air fitting tail screwed in there. I was basically directing all the trash down to the carb itself. I am sure I will need to address the two way shut-off valve when that time comes also. For now that will be getting removed and thrown into the 'removed original equipment' box.

This started first click and ran perfectly. Radiator warmed up, transport tray raised and lowered countless times, PTO and clutch all operated, Governor holding fine.

I did take pics of all three fuel tanks and they are pretty much identical. I did think one was longer but not so.
I will post pics soon. The insides of the Cropmaster tank and the black tank, that was on the 25C, are in fact pretty clean.
There is definitely a leak between the tanks on the Cropmaster though, right at the very bottom as I drained fuel from the large tank only, at least on the outlet of the valve. I guess there is a chance I have an internal leak of the valve.

User avatar
cobbadog
Posts: 1081
Joined: Tue Oct 11, 2011 6:18 am
Location: beautiful Coopernook NSW. near Taree. NSW. Australia

Re: Cropmaster Fuel Issue

Post by cobbadog » Sat Jul 18, 2020 7:27 am

Is that one of your modified distributors in the last pic? The cap looks like it is not fitted correctly with the cut out facing outwards.
What is the 'valve' in the fuel tank you are mentioning?

baron_beeza
Posts: 27
Joined: Sat Jun 29, 2019 1:25 pm
Location: NZ

Re: Cropmaster Fuel Issue

Post by baron_beeza » Sat Jul 18, 2020 8:42 am

Actually I was a bit lazy. It was coming on dark here so I checked the album and found this pic. It is the pics from the farmer in the days before he gave me the Cropmaster. I think I am running with the distributor off the 25C today. Yep, I recall I made one up out of two. The Jap distributor will be on the 25C until I sort out something else for it.

When I drained the fuel I just took the bowl off the gascolator/2 way valve. I dipped both tanks, TVO and Petrol as the fuel drained. I took 13 litres out and the levels dropped in unison. I assumed the hole is between the tanks at the very bottom.
I then realised that the two pipes come together at the selector valve and I thought there may be a possibility of a cross feeding at that point. You have had a valve apart and may be able to say if it is a possibility. I did notice the valve was slow when selected to the rear position so I may just have some crud in there also. (Tank outlet or valve).

baron_beeza
Posts: 27
Joined: Sat Jun 29, 2019 1:25 pm
Location: NZ

Re: Cropmaster Fuel Issue

Post by baron_beeza » Sun Jul 19, 2020 5:49 am

Running on my 4 litre tank.

Image[

I turned the 25C tank around so it was back to front. Normally the outlets would prevent you doing this but the two locating dowels did line up. My outlets were on the rusty portion so were either not there or simply bent out the way.
I had to drill new holes so the instrument panel could be remounted.
The wrap-around mounting strap and the bonnet (short version) straddled my filler caps perfectly.

I am not using the scuttle so the tractor is now farm ready again. Next job will be getting some work done on the implements, fitting a floor to the transport tray and the likes.

User avatar
cobbadog
Posts: 1081
Joined: Tue Oct 11, 2011 6:18 am
Location: beautiful Coopernook NSW. near Taree. NSW. Australia

Re: Cropmaster Fuel Issue

Post by cobbadog » Sun Jul 19, 2020 12:33 pm

Your 2 way tap has 2 inlets and only 1 outlet. So what should happen is that you should have a separate fuel line running to each inlet, the fuel lines into the tap should not be connected to each other. The idea is so you can start on petrol from the small tank then once warmed up switch over to the main tank of TVO. So if you lines do connect before the tap this is your connection and why both tanks drained equally.
If you need a pic as best as I can get of the separate fuel lines going to the tap I can try and get one for you.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 35 guests